GOVERNMENT SERVICES
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Will the Committee of Supply please come to order. The Committee of Supply will be considering the Estimates of the Department of Government Services. Does the honourable Minister of Government Services have an opening statement?
Hon. Frank Pitura (Minister of Government Services): Yes, I do, Mr. Chairman. I am pleased to present the 1998-99 fiscal year spending Estimates for the Department of Government Services and for vote 27.1. Emergency Expenditures.
My first year as the Minister of Government Services has been a memorable one, to say the least. It was this time last year that I found myself the new minister of four months and about to face the flood of the century. While the rest of the country and the world watched, the Manitoba Emergency Management Organization co-ordinated untold responses to protect people and property from the flood waters.
The greatest achievement in memory of the flood of 1997 for the Manitoba Emergency Management Organization and Manitobans is that we fought the flood of the century without loss of one human life. The emergency response was successful in minimizing the effects of the flood. MEMO was working and improving our emergency response capabilities by developing plans and procedures to address the needs identified during the flood. The province is working at building a more detailed response structure, providing a clear definition of the roles and responsibilities of all levels of governments, developing evaluation criteria, improving and expanding emergency preparedness training.
As a result of the flood of the century, all rural municipalities, especially in the Red River Valley, have a heightened awareness of the co-ordinating role Manitoba Emergency Management Organization has to play in responding to emergencies. Manitoba Emergency Management Organization and the Union of Manitoba Municipalities are in the process of working together to identify how we can better enhance emergency preparedness in the province. MEMO and UMM are examining strategies to support communities in enhancing their state of emergency preparedness. I would also add that, as well, the Manitoba Association of Urban Municipalities are involved in this process.
This includes identifying means of motivating and supporting community programs as well as looking at the potential of a municipal emergency preparedness accreditation system. As a result of the flood, communities in the Red River Valley from Emerson to the R.M. of St. Clements have formed a Red River coalition. I would probably put a little bit of a check on that, because I do not believe that the municipalities in the Red River coalition go beyond the southern part of the city of Winnipeg. However, we would add that MEMO is working with the Red River coalition in updating their emergency plans and emergency preparedness programs.
The flood is over, but the disaster recovery efforts are not. MEMO's efforts have been focused on meeting the needs of Manitobans in rebuilding their homes and businesses. MEMO has developed a comprehensive provincial disaster recovery plan that will address the financial means of Manitobans expeditiously.
One of the programs Manitoba Emergency Management Organization established, the temporary accommodation program, has provided assistance to over 600 households. The program was established to provide assistance for temporary accommodations for flood victims who required a safe place to live while restoring their homes. This program will continue until all residents in the Red River Valley are able to return to their homes.
To give my honourable colleagues an appreciation of the magnitude of the Disaster Financial Assistance Program, MEMO has processed over 5,200 claims and awarded claims of over $63 million to Manitobans who suffered losses as a result of the 1997 flood. The Province of Manitoba has made a number of changes to the Disaster Financial Assistance guidelines to ensure fair and equitable treatment for victims of the 1997 flood.
I cannot say often enough how grateful I am for the dedication of those involved in fighting the flood and in the disaster recovery efforts that are still ongoing. As minister and as someone personally threatened by the flood, I am so appreciative of the efforts above and beyond the call of duty day after day for weeks which seemed without end. I know it takes a special kind of person who dedicates himself to work in the emergency response field. It is our staff who meet the victims of disasters face to face. It is our staff who provide the human face of government in times of disasters, and, in carrying out their duties, our staff daily absorbs and witnesses the suffering caused by disasters.
As a government, it is our primary responsibility to help people recover, but we should never lose sight of the emotional toll that disasters wreak on their victims and on those that work to assist. For the many times I have said thank you to staff on previous occasions, I would like to say thank you again.
In another aspect of emergency preparedness, the Minister of Natural Resources and I announced in March that the province had purchased two additional CL-215 water bombers in order to protect Manitobans from the devastation of forest fires. Manitoba now has a fleet of seven water bombers to provide protection to the citizens of rural Manitoba and to protect our province's forestry resources.
My department, through the Desktop Management Unit, is assisting in preparing government to meet the technological changes of the future and the changes that must be in place for the next millennium. The government in Manitoba is re-engineering a number of corporate systems such as payables, disbursements, procurements, and moving toward further shared use of common databases. To support the government-wide information and financial systems that the province is implementing, a desktop and local area network technology infrastructure is required that will be uniform, reliable and flexible. Security of data will be paramount and will be enhanced. The desktop initiative refers to the desktop and network infrastructure and support services that are being put in place to move toward a corporate managed system for the future of government in Manitoba.
The situation the government in Manitoba is addressing regarding Desktop Management is common to most mid and large organizations, both public and private sector. We made the decision to move to a managed desktop environment and outsource significant components of the desktop technology based on the direct benefits to the province and to the public. Benefits such as standardizing and integrating key desktop management functions will result in a well-managed base infrastructure that can adapt to meet changing program needs. This new infrastructure will result in government being able to provide better information and services to the public throughout this province. With the Desktop Management Unit assuming responsibility for in-house computer maintenance, the remaining functions of the former Office Equipment branch were realigned and savings achieved through elimination of operating costs.
Responsibility for the provision of facsimile services and copier services is now with the Telecommunications branch. Responsibility for the standard Office Equipment management is now with the Materials Distribution Agency. You will notice the Supplementary Information reflects the establishment of Desktop Management Services as a separate branch. In its initial year, Desktop Management was a subcomponent of the Telecommunications branch.
The 1998-99 Estimates of my department reflect full year operating and staffing levels for the Desktop Management program. As minister responsible for The Government Purchases Act, my department and I will be providing advice on a re-engineering of the corporate procurement system which is part of the government's Better Methods and a year 2000 initiative. It is envisioned that the Purchasing branch will be restructured into an entity responsible for policies and guidelines regarding all procurement in the Manitoba government. The Purchasing office will focus on strategic planning of government requirements, development of large contracts and consultative procurement services rather than transactional processing of individual needs.
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The Department of Government Services is very much involved in partnerships with other levels of government and government agencies in developing opportunities to achieve cost savings and improve service and program delivery to the public. This department has been instrumental in planning and completing the co-location of federal and provincial programs and staff. Manitoba Environment and Environment Canada offices are co-located in the Union Station VIA Rail Station at Broadway and Main. Manitoba Industry, Trade and Tourism and the federal western diversification offices are co-located in the Cargill Building on Graham Avenue providing a one-stop shop for small business assistance.
My department is continuing to pursue other opportunities for co-location with the federal government, and a working group of federal and provincial officials meet on a regular basis to discuss partnership initiatives. In partnering with other levels of government, whether it is the city or the federal government and whether I use the term co-location or amalgamation, it is the goal of the single-taxpayer concept that motivates the department's overall direction in accommodation planning.
My department is working with the town of Churchill to develop a business arrangement, more of a business relationship that will improve the ongoing support for the town centre complex. In another northern community, Leaf Rapids, my department is actively involved on the board in determining a future direction for their town centre. We are also taking a more businesslike approach with our clients by establishing performance measures and indicators to ensure that we are offering services in the most cost-effective manner.
The property management functions of the Department of Government Services over the past year have been assessing alternative methods of service delivery. Through the assessment of service delivery, the department investigates which means of providing services is best suited to the client and the location. Alternative service delivery may result in the combining of functions with departments or levels of government. Alternative service delivery is about improving a single-taxpayer concept.
A few years ago, this government developed a visionary approach for the future direction of the province. The Manitoba framework document provided core business principles which sets the tone and example of my department's business dealings. The department has been successful in negotiating favourable rental rates and reducing lease costs which will provide substantial savings to the province. By living within our means as a province and as a department, we have been able to put capital dollars back into the economy to create jobs and build and renovate facilities necessary to offer programs that improve the quality of life in Manitoba.
Over the past few years, my department has been able to increase dollars allocated to capital projects. This year, my department will spend $18.2 million on capital projects. The department will be able to proceed with major projects, some of which have been in the planning stages for years. These projects have a geographical representation to them in that they are in Winnipeg, Headingley, Portage la Prairie and Brandon. These projects support the Manitoba framework by enhancing the facilities that house educational, social service and justice programs in this province.
Phase 1 of the project to retrofit Building A at the Red River Community College has commenced. The contract has been awarded to Bird Construction. Building A, which was originally constructed in 1962, has recurring and increasingly severe problems. The financial responsibility for the project is being shared with the Red River Community College, and the project will be completed over a three-year period.
So that we may continue to learn from our past, the province has undertaken project management of relocating the Hudson's Bay archives to the Provincial Archives Building. The $2.5-million project will be completed in September of this year. The project will transform the space that once housed the concert hall into environmentally controlled vaults to store the archival material donated to the province by the Hudson's Bay History Foundation.
The Brandon Court House, built in 1906, has long been outmoded and obsolete in terms of size, functionality, fire safety provisions and barrier-free accessibility. Consultation with the various user groups for redevelopment of Law Courts facilities for the Brandon area has been ongoing since 1992. It is anticipated the project will be tendered this July with construction to commence by September.
My department is responding to an immediate need for a high security youth facilities. This summer we will tender for a new 20-bed high security youth custody unit to be located at the Agassiz Youth Centre in Portage la Prairie. The project is anticipated to be completed by March 1999.
In addition to those projects I have mentioned, my department has completed a number of major projects at Headingley Correctional Institution in relation to the restoration and redevelopment of the institution following the 1996 disturbance. One of the final phases in the redevelopment is the construction of a new 76-bed maximum-security unit at Headingley Correctional Institution. Site improvements will begin in June. Construction of the unit will begin in September.
I have mentioned just a few accomplishments and initiatives that my department has to its credit. There are many more. Although events like the flood of the century have brought this department very much into the public eye, it is the nature of my department's mandate to manage support functions and to provide efficient service, safety and security. This support allows other departments to concentrate on the delivery of their programs for the maximum benefit of all Manitobans.
In closing, I would like to say thank you to all the staff of the Department of Government Services, who work often without recognition in assisting their client departments and thereby serving the people of Manitoba.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Thank you, Mr. Minister. Would the honourable critic for the opposition have an opening statement?
Mr. Jim Maloway (Elmwood): Mr. Chairman, I would like to thank the minister for his state of the department address this afternoon. I would suggest, however, in the interests of time constraints, that we move on. I would like to ask questions on the computer contracts. I think we can do that in one of the sections that we will move to soon.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): Under the practice, the debate of the Minister's Salary is traditionally the last item on the agenda. Is that the wish of the committee? [agreed] Before we do that, we invite the minister's staff to join us at the table. We will then move into the consideration of the Estimates.
I wonder if the minister would like to introduce his staff.
Mr. Pitura: I have with me Deputy Minister Hugh Eliasson; Assistant Deputy Minister of Supply and Services Gerry Berezuk; Gerry Bosma, our director of Financial Administration; and Dave Primmer, the director of the Desktop Management Unit.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): 8.1.(b) Executive Support (1) Salaries and Employee Benefits.
Mr. Maloway: By way of procedure, I was going to suggest that we move to 8.1.(e) Information Technology Services. I think I can ask most of my questions under that particular area. We have done this in the past, last year. We have done it with the Consumer and Corporate Affairs Estimates so we do not go line by line until the very end.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): I wonder if that might be an agreement that we might strike, that we not be too particular about the line-by-line Estimates, if the minister would concur to that. Is that agreed? [agreed] Proceed.
Mr. Maloway: I would like to ask the minister if he could at this time provide us with a copy of the contract between the government and SHL.
Mr. Pitura: The short answer to that is, no, I cannot. I hope that the member will appreciate the fact that when the contracts are signed between a private company and the provincial government that there is substantial commercial information in the contract which is of a competitive and hence a confidential nature. Therefore, we are not in the position to be able to release the contract with SHL.
Mr. Maloway: I wonder whether the minister would agree to release the hardware contract that was given to IBM.
Mr. Pitura: Well, perhaps I can clear up a bit of fuzziness here with the honourable member. Our contract with Systemhouse--under that contract, Systemhouse was to supply a totally managed desktop environment for the province. Under that contract, they had to meet certain performance standards that would provide the province with a certain level of service and level of technology, for lack of a better term.
With regard to Systemhouse's contract with IBM, that is a contract that they underwent themselves to procure desktop hardware and, as such, that is a contract between Systemhouse and IBM. It is not between IBM and the province. I hope that clarifies the situation for the member.
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Mr. Maloway: It does not clarify anything. It just simply confirms in my own mind what we have been saying all along. That is that this government is using this as a diversion to hide the contract. By giving SHL the carte blanche agreement to run the system, then it allows SHL to make all the subagreements and then he can claim that it is out of his control.
The fact of the matter is that the government does have a lot of say in who gets what in this agreement. As a matter fact, the minister is aware that a team of four individuals reviewed and evaluated the proposals for the hardware contract. I would like to ask him whether he would give us, provide us, with the list of the names of the four individuals and their qualifications at this time.
Mr. Pitura: I am advised that all four of the staff that evaluated that contract were staff of SHL, and that included their senior management and their technical specialists. There were no staff from the provincial government.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, that was not my question, though. The question was: what were the names of the four people, and what were their qualifications?
Mr. Pitura: Well, that is, I guess, what I am trying to communicate with the honourable member is the fact that the people who evaluated the contract were from SHL, and I am not apprised of their names. If they were provincial government employees, I might be able to have a handle on the names, but, since they are with SHL, I do not have that.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, would the minister endeavour to obtain that information for me?
Mr. Pitura: Well, I think that, since the contract is between SHL and IBM, the honourable member may want to approach SHL to see if they would release those names to him.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, the minister knows that is not realistic. The minister is in charge of this department, not SHL, and the question is to him. I am asking him to get me this information, tell me who the members are of this evaluation team.
Mr. Pitura: Well, I am not sure where the honourable member is going on this, but, as I indicated earlier, they are employees of Systemhouse. As such, it would be up to Systemhouse to release the names of their evaluation team.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, I understand that the evaluation team made this decision and that they reviewed it with his department, with Manitoba. So surely he knows who the members of this team were because they met with his department.
Mr. Pitura: I am advised that, in terms of the department's involvement, once the selection process was in place and the evaluation was done, the members of my department reviewed the selection process, but not the respective team itself.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, well, your department people met with the team. Surely, they know the names of the people they met with.
Mr. Pitura: Well, to the honourable member, I will endeavour to contact Systemhouse and see if they will release the names of the evaluation team for me. If they do, in that case, I will gladly share them with the honourable member.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, I would like to know who from his department then met with this selection team.
Mr. Pitura: Mr. Chairman, I am advised that the leaders of the evaluation team met with our director of the Desktop Management Unit, David Primmer.
Mr. Maloway: Mr. Chairman, the evaluation process is, you know, very nebulous at best in my view, and without knowing all of the details it is impossible for me to decide that they did make the right decision. But, clearly, they used some very nebulous criteria in the selection process. I have asked now many times that that minister release to us a copy of the point system used, an explanation of the point system used, because it was never explained to the bidders, at least to their satisfaction. I think that is all we want to know. We want to know of the 11 bidders how many points did each one of these get.
So I would like to ask the minister if he would, at this point, release to me or give me a copy of the names of the 11 bidders.
Mr. Pitura: I would have to answer in part to the last question that the honourable member asked that, no, I cannot, due to the confidential nature of the way that the tendering process is done. I think it could possibly, in terms of having the 11 names that were there--in fact, I thank the honourable member for informing me that there are 11 names. I was not apprised of that.
But for the honourable member's benefit, I think what we have to do is take a look at how the tendering process and the open bidding system works within the provincial government. The honourable member has it in his mind that the evaluation process and the criteria that were put into place were somehow seemingly done only in this particular type of contract and therefore is suspect, but within the bidding process for government contracts, it is not unusual for a contract to be laid out so that there is a number of criteria that are listed to be able to assess whether a bidder is awarded the contract or not.
I think that the honourable member should be aware, as well, that even when individuals apply for a position within the provincial government, that in order to have an objective evaluation, a point system is used in a number of categories during the interview process to end up with a score for each individual who applies for a position. This is done in many human resource areas within government.
So when you come down to a contract like this and you take a look at it, certainly cost is an important part of the process. However, the overall aspect of the contract has to be evaluated in terms of not just supplying a product carte blanche--put it on the table and walk away from it--but there is service that has to be performed on the product and the ability to ensure that the product quality is there. So these evaluation criteria are put into place for these contracts.
I just want to share with the member, too, that with the selection process with regard to this particular contract, Manitoba provided Systemhouse with the criteria based on product standards developed by the Desktop Management Unit in consultation with departmental Information Technology staff. So all the staff within the provincial government first put together what they felt was the product standard that they required for the Desktop Unit to function within government. No problem with that, okay?
Manitoba then reviewed the government procurement process to ensure that the Systemhouse process was consistent with the government process. So Systemhouse was required to use the government process in their request. So then this request for proposal was issued on a national electronic tendering service which is called MERX, okay? That was put on October 17, and the RFP clearly communicated the evaluation criteria. So everybody knew what the ground rules were in the response to this proposal.
Manufacturers had two weeks to respond. The first week was reserved for questions from manufacturers of Systemhouse in terms of, you know, there may be some areas of the RFP that some of the manufacturers did not quite understand and they wanted clarification on. They have that ability to ask those questions. So the responses were due by October 31 of last year. Thirty-nine manufacturers requested copies of the RFP; 11 manufacturers responded with proposals. I am sorry, I did have the number here.
The evaluation was conducted from November 1 to 9, and the process and the results were reviewed with Manitoba on November 10.
The Acting Chairperson (Mr. Penner): The hour being 5 p.m., committee rise.